The problem with comic book heroes...

[hells_half_acre]

I think part of my reluctance to get into the Marvel fandom is the fact that comic books don't end... and nothing happy ever happens in them. Yes, the hero saves the day, but it's usually at the cost of their own happiness. Their best friends and/or lovers die... or they do, tragically. You need drama to keep a story like that going and the best drama is tragedy.

So, for instance, I've been enjoying Captain America fic recently, but the fic that I'm enjoying is the sort of stuff that would never actually happen in the official story - because it's the fic where everyone is broken and is never going to get better, yet they learn to live with their brokenness and they learn to be happy, and the fic ends with the premise that everything has reached a stage of "as joyful as possible given the circumstances" and it will remain that way until all characters die of old age. Whereas, I already know that depending on what comic-book plot they follow, and, to me, all evidence points to the fact that they are going to follow this one...there's a good chance that Steve Rogers is going to die and Bucky Barnes will become Captain America. And that's not a happy ending, because someone is dead and someone must live without them.

I like things that end. Ironically, it was part of the reason I got into Supernatural - I was convinced that it would end after S5, and even if it ended in tragedy (which, at the time, Supernatural had all the markings of a clear tragedy), I would be fine with that, because at least it would have a definite end to the tragedy - and the tragedy would not continue forever. Comic books just keep going and they are ALWAYS tragic and nothing ever works out, not completely. And even if one chapter ends on a happy note, you know the next chapter is going to destroy that happiness... and I don't think I can take that when there's no clear end to the misery in sight.

Comments

[hells-half-acre.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and I suppose I CAN handle a death if it's done well. For the Torchwood example, I was fine with Owen and Tosh's death, but not Ianto's. I'm just not sure where on the line the potential death in the MCU would fall.

I had the same beef with Coulson's resurrection. I still haven't watched AoS, though I do hear it's gotten better.

Also MCU is easier than the bajillion issues of comics you're missing because you weren't born in the 30s.

Haha, exactly, I have a hard enough time keeping up with CURRENT media, let alone a 80 year backlog. :P

I can get you downloads of all Hawkeye issues if you want. :) IT GETS SO GOOD/PAINFULL.

Could you?!? I would appreciate it!!

[franztastisch]

Well it depends. For that scenario above, I'm slightly dubious because of 1) Sebastian Stan's ability to act Cap, 2) his ability to follow on from Chris Evans and 3) fans reaction to the leaving of Chris Evans who, let's be honest, is sort of perfect for the role. That being said, we don't know the contract length for Chris Evans and nothing is set in stone anyway. Marvel don't have to use Stan's 9 films. On the other hand, Marvel will keep this going for as long as they can. So... I'll roll with it, trust them and see what happens. Though let's be honest, I could lose interest before it ends. Cos this could go on for decades. :P

Hawkeye. This is updated every issue released, which you can tell by following my tumblr. But you need a reader programme to open them. Do you have one?

Oh, and because I was snooping your convo below. There is no such thing as concrete or coherent canon in Marvel comics. I solve this by just making shit up. And I think this is a fandom where it is really easy to enjoy all the fannish outpouring without actually seeing the films or anything.

[hells-half-acre.livejournal.com]

Awesome! Thanks! I do have a reader program. I downloaded it when I read the first few hawkeye editions - then I lost the link to wherever I was getting those editions from, and now I can't remember where the reader IS on my computer, but I know I haven't deleted it - so I just have to track down whatever subfolder I stuck it in. :P

Well it depends. For that scenario above, I'm slightly dubious because of 1) Sebastian Stan's ability to act Cap, 2) his ability to follow on from Chris Evans and 3) fans reaction to the leaving of Chris Evans who, let's be honest, is sort of perfect for the role. That being said, we don't know the contract length for Chris Evans and nothing is set in stone anyway. Marvel don't have to use Stan's 9 films.

True, true... maybe I'm getting ahead of myself, and reading too much into Stan's 9 film deal. Based on absolutely nothing (because I haven't actually seen the films yet... but probably will this weekend or next week), I don't doubt Stan's ability to play Cap, though it would, by necessity, be a different kind of Cap... but whether fans would accept anyone other than Evans is another matter altogether.

So... I'll roll with it, trust them and see what happens. Though let's be honest, I could lose interest before it ends. Cos this could go on for decades. :P

Very true... it takes me SO LONG to see movies, it's ridiculous. I really only go to the theatres maybe once or twice a year these days, and so it's all about whether or not my interest holds enough to track them down later.

Oh, and because I was snooping your convo below. There is no such thing as concrete or coherent canon in Marvel comics. I solve this by just making shit up. And I think this is a fandom where it is really easy to enjoy all the fannish outpouring without actually seeing the films or anything.

True. That's what I've been doing with Cap so far, after all.

[franztastisch]

I think you got that from me too, in which case it's called CDisplay, if that helps you track it down.

Yeah, I think the long ad short of it is that we don;t know. And they might just get Stan to be the Winter Soldier all the way through (which in a way would make more sense. Comic readers would be fine with Bucky!Cap but the casual viewer would be very much WTF!?).

Really all I want out of this is a Black Widow film and more Hawkeye. I'm cool with most other things (apart from Ant-Man, still very dubious about Ant-Man).

Considering your track record with films, I'd just stick to reading fic and making of it what you will. They bring out about three films a year. Plus there's TV shows and actual comics and it all adds up. *shrugs* You like continuity. I think it would annoy you not to know all the story available. But that's not my call. And I'm happy to answer any and all questions I can. :P

[hells-half-acre.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I think I may have ended up with a different one though, because CDisplay didn't work on my computron... a quick scan of my files says I have something called "Comic Seer" so I'm willing to bet that might be the one that worked! And hey, I know where it is now!

And they might just get Stan to be the Winter Soldier all the way through (which in a way would make more sense. Comic readers would be fine with Bucky!Cap but the casual viewer would be very much WTF!?).

Yeah, I think I'd prefer if Stan was the Winter Soldier all the way through.

Really all I want out of this is a Black Widow film and more Hawkeye. I'm cool with most other things (apart from Ant-Man, still very dubious about Ant-Man).

SAME!

Considering your track record with films, I'd just stick to reading fic and making of it what you will. They bring out about three films a year. Plus there's TV shows and actual comics and it all adds up. *shrugs* You like continuity. I think it would annoy you not to know all the story available. But that's not my call. And I'm happy to answer any and all questions I can. :P

You are more than likely completely correct. I'll probably just watch the two Captain America films and then go back to my happy fic world. And read Hawkeye, because I like Hawkeye. And I'll watch Agent Carter, because of all the reasons to watch Agent Carter. But that's IT! ;)

[franztastisch]

Stan as the Winter Soldier works better for me too. He looks so pretty when he's upset. :P

You are more than likely completely correct. I'll probably just watch the two Captain America films and then go back to my happy fic world. And read Hawkeye, because I like Hawkeye. And I'll watch Agent Carter, because of all the reasons to watch Agent Carter. But that's IT! ;)

Oh that is a slippery slope my friend. :P though, for your consideration; Gardians of the Galaxy for the sheer lunacy. (I AM SO EXCITED FOR THIS FILM)

[hells-half-acre.livejournal.com]

Oh man, Guardians!! I FORGOT THAT WAS MARVEL!

Geeeeeeez... it's such a slippery slope. I will probably have to watch that one too. :P

[franztastisch]

AHA soon you will backslide into lunacy with the rest of us. :D

(You can pretend it's not Marvel if that makes it easier. I don't know where it falls in Marvel continuity yet.)