Rewatch S12: The British Invasion (12x17)
Jan. 22nd, 2018 09:38 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
hells_half_acreOkay, rewatch for the second day in a row...
The British Invasion
I'm going to be honest and admit that I don't want to watch this episode... even though it has Eileen in it... because it's a BuckLeming episode, it furthers the stupid plots, and UGH, BuckLeming.
So, this is going to be an attempt at doing this as quickly as possible - and mostly using it try to think of rewrites.
We start off at Kendricks, where we see young Mick, so that we might gain sympathy for him as an adult. He has no home to go to for Christmas, which I guess sets him up as some sort of evil Harry Potter.
The RIDICULOUS thing comes with the stupid "final exam" that has a 50% survival rate by design. WHO ON EARTH would send their kids to this school? Especially if they were "legacy" kids. So, yeah, let's see if I can tackle that issue...
Rewrite: Instead of a fellow student, the child has to kill a MONSTER child - maybe even a monster child who doesn't know they're a monster - think of things like the Ruguru, which SPN loves SAYING but has never actually shown since their first appearance. They don't "become" a monster until well into adulthood, up until then, they appear and believe themselves to be human. So, put the kid in a room with that sort of monster, you could even build it up like - maybe the headmistress had Mick tutoring this "new" kid and they become friends, as kids do, and then the reveal is that his new friend was a monster all along and it's a test. OR, you could even have it be a werewolf kid, and then that directly ties in with the previous episode, where now Mick has seen that they can be cured, and that Sam and Dean believe it's possible for them to be good, and now Mick is questioning the code.
If it's a friendly monster child, the headmistresses line of "but the code demands it" make WAY more sense. Since why the heck would a hunting society have a code that involved killing humans?
Eileen!!! I love her.
And her and Sam are SUPER CUTE. And I ship them big time. I love them. Sam deserves happiness.
Dean: "No, dude, we're not calling Crowley"
Mick: "Hello boys"
- not to beat a dead horse, but Mick happening to be in the bunker and therefore overhearing this conversation would be way more meaningful if we knew he was investigating them for corruption/ties-to-demons.
Sam: "Did you break into our house?"
- Okay, firstly, I love the fact that Sam calls a MASSIVE LABRYTHINE BUNKER "our house" - it's so... adorable.
Mick: "Did you know your key opens every Men of Letter's chapter house in the world?"
- I WANTED THIS TO MATTER SO MUCH. Like, man, I wanted them to fly to England and just be like "BURN IT DOWN!" Alas, it is something that only makes them vulnerable, rather than makes them a threat.
Mick: "Sometime ago, the home office recorded a massive shock-wave..."
Sam: "Nephilim."
Mick: "You knew?"
...
Dean: "Well, Lucifer hijacked the president, then knocked up his girlfriend..."
[...]
Mick: "You should have shot her between the eyes, immediately!"
- So, we finally get to see how BEHIND the BMoL are with the times. Mick advocates for just shooting Kelly Kline. I'd like to point out here, that "just kill everything" actually DOES make the job easier to do for people of less skill. You have to be MORE skilled in combat, knowledge, and experience, in order to deal with nuances. Think about it like a customer service job (because one of my jobs is customer survice) - if every time there is a complaint, you said "oh sorry, here's a 10% off coupon for your next order." your job is 100x easier than someone who says "oh, sorry, let me see if I can address the complications of your particular situation and come up with a customized solution just for you." The BMoL hand out death coupons and make all the problems go away.
Rewrite: I actually DO like the level of freaked-out Mick is when he hears what happened, but I would like to dial it up - make it clear that they've never dealt with Lucifer before. Make it clear that they've never dealt with rogue angels before... make it clear that the BMoL are out of their depth and the Winchesters aren't.
So, more flashbacks to kid-Mick - we find out the test is to make sure they'll execute orders without question. I think the same could be indicated with a monster child.
Then we get the call from Britain, where the headmistress person, tells Mick that his mission parameters have changed. And the Winchesters either obey, or they're killed.
Rewrite: You just need to change the language a little - have Mick be report about how he's trying to understand what code, if any, the Winchesters follow - have HQ tell him that if he can't prove that they follow THEIR code, and if they can't be brought to heel, then they should be eliminated.
Dagon and Kelly stuff can stay the same, FYI, just cut out the bits where Lucifer is talking to Dagon. In the rewrite, Dagon is doing this for her own purposes alone.
We get more of Mick's tragic backstory - and a great insight into the fact that he was most likely coerced into joining as a kid, but didn't question it because his alternative was homelessness, but now is beginning to feel trapped.
Crowley and Lucifer scenes... blah...sorry sorry, I'll stop complaining. In order to rewrite this scene, I have to figure out what it's purpose is... Lucifer is pretending to be broken, supposedly in order to avoid the cage. So...
Rewrite: Asmodeus (and/or) Dagon make a show of respecting Crowley's reign, after having previously threatened him. Crowley is suspicious...
Back to Ketch and Mary... Ketch IS actually acting way more domestic in his relationship with Mary than Mary is. And Ketch asks about her former retirement and how she seems drawn to danger - and I think this is another case of someone trying to interpret Mary the way they want to, rather than the way she is.
Remy and Mick scene - this scene can stay. We could even add an edge to it, with a simple rewrite of having the home office concerned about needing more hands, now that there's news of the nephilim - which further shows that they don't know how to deal with this level of stuff.
Eileen!!
Stuff about this scene I love - how both Sam and Dean modify their body language and speaking habits. They face Eileen head-on. When Sam's been speaking, but Dean wants to ask a question, he moves his hand from behind Sam's head to in front of himself, so that Eileen knows he wants her to listen to him.
I love the little flashback of Eileen killing the demon. "Hunter!" "Demon." Hahaha
Back with Crowley... let's see what the point of this scene is... Crowley makes a bit todo about having broken Lucifer, meanwhile, Lucifer uses it as an opportunity to undermine him by showing that he hasn't been broken at all and is fooling Crowley, therefore Crowley undermines his own authority by showing him off - which is stupid to have fallen for.
So, rewrite: Instead of Crowley being an idiot (because he's NOT), he's not in this scene. Instead, we get Asmodeus, or his messenger, addressing the court while Crowley is "out" and telling them that Crowley's reign is coming to an end, and any show of loyalty they made was just to keep him complacent and his defensive low so that he can be usurped by one (or both) of the Princes of Hell.
Now, bonus points rewrite: Crowley is actually overhearing this, and or, has a plant in the thrown room, and HEARS all this, and we get his reaction - is he angry? Is he tied? Does he double down his defenses? Does he want to retire anyway? We could be left with intriguing questions of character here as well as feel anticipation for how this coup may or may not go down.
Sam's funny accent is awesome.
Sam finding Eileen hilarious and awesome is cute.
And we get the showdown in by the bridges with the BMoL, Kelly, and Dagon.
Abortion conversations are always difficult. I was actually surprised they pulled off this storyline without any super problematic language.
And Eileen takes the shot, but Dagon fades out and she accidentally shoots Remy.
Friendly fire, man. Sucks.
So then we finally get the code conflicting directly with the Winchester's mercy. And Sam talks him down. It's actually the Free Will argument that they had back int he day with Castiel, though that was less obvious - there's more to life than blind obedience. And Mick lets them go.
Then Ketch and Mary have had sex. Mary gives him the "this was a one-night stand" speech. Ketch covers, but not well enough for us to actually believe him.
Ketch then commends her for making the choice of work, rather than family. Mary takes umbrage with the either/or argument. But, in so doing, DOES indicate that she's not 100x loyal to the BMoL.
Okay, Lucifer scene - this is just us learning that there's a delay in the coup to usurp Crowley.
Rewrite: So, do we need this scene? No, I don't think so... we COULD just cut it. OR... we could have Crowley do something that delays whatever Asmodeus has planned.
Sam comforts Eileen, and I love them.
Kelly is cuffed up by Dagon, and the truth comes out - the baby will live regardless of how well Kelly looks after herself during the pregnancy, but Kelly will surely die regardless at the end of the pregnancy.
And Ketch kills Mick.
We can see this as a foreshadow for someone who is changed by the Winchesters losing their life BECAUSE of that change (which we will see with Crowley at the end of the season.)
So, although I like Mick, I suppose we can keep it in. It IS a good death, in that it foreshadows another, and there's very little way that Mick can get out of this situation. ALSO, Mick NEEDS to lose command and not have any way of warning the Winchesters - because we need it to be clear that
Rewrite: "They will be investigated, and if they're found guilty, they will be executed..." would become "Your investigation should have been concluded, and the Winchesters found guilty" and then Mick could make his argument that Hunters are always found guilty and it's not right." And then she could say "We do need them for the time-being, however, they obviously have connections to the Nephilim.." or whatnot, which would explain why Ketch just doesn't go kill them right off the bat.
Really, in both the original and my rewrite, it would be this scene where we'd find out that MICK was the "rogue" agent while Toni was very much in keeping with the company line.
And yes, the BMoL can still hunt Eileen, I'm not changing that (yet).
The boys don't know where Cas is and are starting to get really worried.
But they DO have the Colt, for now. (RIP)
Dean: "Welcome back, sweetheart"
- I really do wish they could have kept it.
Then we get the extermination order from the BMoL, which can also still stand.
CUT SCENES
Scene 25
Sam and Dean researching in the Bunker, before Eileen arrives. Dean likes the movie ParentTrap.
Eileen calls. Sam picks up and says hi Eileen, and Dean yells from across the room "HEY EILEEN" and Sam looks at him super annoyed, because she can't hear him.
It's definitely a pretty pointless scene.
COMMENTARY
BuckLeming and Adam Fergus (Mick) and David Haydn-Jones (Ketch)
David of course doesn't have an accent IRL, so it's funny to hear him talk on the commentary.
Buckner thinks that the killing your friend thing is a great showcase of how ruthless they are. My argument of course is that killing a monster kid is ALSO ruthluss and makes WAY more sense.
Eugunie talking about how when the show started, Dean was the hardlined one and Sam was independent thinking and more nuanced in his views - but now seasons later, they're both independent thinkers. So it's them encountering a hardline thinker again.
Adam talks about how in the scene in the Bunker with Sam and Dean, how Jensen kept pouring the whiskey everywhere because he wasn't looking where he was pouring.
That leads them into a conversation about how welcoming the boys are and how it's the reason the show has lasted as long as it has, etc.
David and Buckner have similar voices so it's hard for me to figure out who is speaking unless they're saying something job specific. ONE of them talks about how the show has lasted because the creators behind it are also passionate about it and have remained so.
Jensen encouraged Adam to adlib in the scene in the kitchen.
David asks about how much was imagined from the beginning of the season - Eugunie says that it's discovered as it goes. They have a vague idea, but sometimes they want to detour mid season, or change things up, and it's decisions made along the way.
Buckner says that they knew the BMoL were going to be the "heavies" but they didn't have all the burocracy figured out.
Eugenie talks about how the actors make you want to write for them.
Buckner talks about how Mick and Ketch were good opposities to Sam and Dean's flannel wearing cowboys.
Eugenie talks about how the boys always act like it's fresh, and never act like they're board after 13 years.
Buckner talks about how Mick knows that the boys know that he's conflicted at times.
The Vodka line was adlibbed by Adam, because they had him drinking tomato juice, which he would never drink unless it was a Bloody Mary.
David talks about how he was reading for procedurals between episodes of Supernatural and they seemed so boring in comparison.
Eugunie had a lot of fun with the Crowley and Lucifer scenes, and apparently acted it out in their office before presenting it - and then acted it out when they presented it. (...gross? Also, just cements how much me and these writers differ in what we like.)
Buckner talks about how Pellegrino acts Lucifer as either wanting to kill everyone or sleep with everyone and no real in between.
David jokes that he should possess Ketch next, because they'd get along well.
Eugenie thinks that Ketch does have "pieces of a soul." David talks about how he was obviously conditioned way harder than anyone else.
They all make fun of Remy.
Adam and David loved the suits. They were all gorgeous.
They praise Shoshanah (So why'd you kill her, you asses? Ugh.)
Then they go back to praising Jensen and Jared for setting the tone, and that's probably part of the reason why the secondary characters are all so great too and the guest actors all are happy to work too.
Adam talks about doing his first scene with Jared and how Jared immediately starteed making fun of his accents - and it was just "banter from day one"
Oh, it was the scene in the throne room that Eugenie and Buckner acted out.
They talk about how if you really want something in the script you have to fight for it.
They praise Pellegrino.
They laugh about how the demons and minions are always just people in suits.
David talks about how the pregnancy nicely tees up S13. David really sounds like he's a genuine fan of the show.
They make fun of Jared's "british" accents.
David doesn't think that Jared and Jensen knew that he wasn't actually British, because he did a "weird actory thing" where he never broke accent - because he didn't want to lose it.
Adam tells a story about how there were train tracks between the trailors and sets, and a few times they got stuck behind really long trains trying to get to set and ended up late.
Eugenie talks about how Vancouver really helps the show. "There is a lurking doom" - hahah, okay, I do like that description of Vancouver.
They talk about the Shaving People Punting Things re-edit of this scene.
They talk about how brutal it was to shoot - because it was night, and cold, with a lot of different coverage, stunts, effects, etc.
Eugenie jokes that no one felt bad for Remy, because he was a twit.
They talk about Mary sleeping with Ketch, mostly the laugh at it. And are they both lying or is it just Ketch. And will the fans forgive Mary for "cheating" on John (I mean, it's not cheating if he's dead, guys. I don't think this is an issue.)
Buckner talks about how they didn't really know what would happen with Mary at the beginning of the season, but they didn't want to go the sainted-mom route... they wanted to make it clear that she was a hunter at heart. Buckner talks about how she was almost the genesis more than John was.
Buckner talks about the myth created after her feath. David agrees and likes how the audience pushes back with that emotionally and that just mirrors the conflict that's happening with the boys as well.
They talk about how great the lighting crew and the production is.
Adam agrees and describes how well oiled it is. Everyone knows what to do without it even really being asked of them - and how it feels like you get an extra day of filming because of it.
Then they talk about the sets and how gorgeous they are. David talks about being in the Bunker and how you don't even have to use your imagination, because it feels like the bunker not a set.
Buckner or David ship Sam and Eileen too... I can't tell who was speaking, I think it may have been Buckner.
Do commentary tracks have closed captioning?! Nope, only the show.. damn. So much for solving my David/Buckner problem. ACCESSIBILITY PEOPLE!
I was distracted there... uh....
They're talking about Mick, and how he's sort of like Oliver Twist.
Adam thinks Mick knows what's going to happen to him for criticizing Hess - even if he doesn't know that Ketch is going to shoot him right then and there.
BuckLeming originally had a storyline where Mick, Toni, and Ketch, were all together as children and had to survive some sort of survivor type test... and you got to explore where they came from and how they formed the way they formed.
Eugenie doesn't think that Ketch has ever been exposed to the moral complications of the world.
Adam talks about the boarding school systems in England and how it is more of a posh thing to do. And how Mick would feel indebted to them for taking him off the streets etc.
David thinks of Ketch as both posh and primal.
As usual, let me know your thoughts in comments!!
The British Invasion
I'm going to be honest and admit that I don't want to watch this episode... even though it has Eileen in it... because it's a BuckLeming episode, it furthers the stupid plots, and UGH, BuckLeming.
So, this is going to be an attempt at doing this as quickly as possible - and mostly using it try to think of rewrites.
We start off at Kendricks, where we see young Mick, so that we might gain sympathy for him as an adult. He has no home to go to for Christmas, which I guess sets him up as some sort of evil Harry Potter.
The RIDICULOUS thing comes with the stupid "final exam" that has a 50% survival rate by design. WHO ON EARTH would send their kids to this school? Especially if they were "legacy" kids. So, yeah, let's see if I can tackle that issue...
Rewrite: Instead of a fellow student, the child has to kill a MONSTER child - maybe even a monster child who doesn't know they're a monster - think of things like the Ruguru, which SPN loves SAYING but has never actually shown since their first appearance. They don't "become" a monster until well into adulthood, up until then, they appear and believe themselves to be human. So, put the kid in a room with that sort of monster, you could even build it up like - maybe the headmistress had Mick tutoring this "new" kid and they become friends, as kids do, and then the reveal is that his new friend was a monster all along and it's a test. OR, you could even have it be a werewolf kid, and then that directly ties in with the previous episode, where now Mick has seen that they can be cured, and that Sam and Dean believe it's possible for them to be good, and now Mick is questioning the code.
If it's a friendly monster child, the headmistresses line of "but the code demands it" make WAY more sense. Since why the heck would a hunting society have a code that involved killing humans?
Eileen!!! I love her.
And her and Sam are SUPER CUTE. And I ship them big time. I love them. Sam deserves happiness.
Dean: "No, dude, we're not calling Crowley"
Mick: "Hello boys"
- not to beat a dead horse, but Mick happening to be in the bunker and therefore overhearing this conversation would be way more meaningful if we knew he was investigating them for corruption/ties-to-demons.
Sam: "Did you break into our house?"
- Okay, firstly, I love the fact that Sam calls a MASSIVE LABRYTHINE BUNKER "our house" - it's so... adorable.
Mick: "Did you know your key opens every Men of Letter's chapter house in the world?"
- I WANTED THIS TO MATTER SO MUCH. Like, man, I wanted them to fly to England and just be like "BURN IT DOWN!" Alas, it is something that only makes them vulnerable, rather than makes them a threat.
Mick: "Sometime ago, the home office recorded a massive shock-wave..."
Sam: "Nephilim."
Mick: "You knew?"
...
Dean: "Well, Lucifer hijacked the president, then knocked up his girlfriend..."
[...]
Mick: "You should have shot her between the eyes, immediately!"
- So, we finally get to see how BEHIND the BMoL are with the times. Mick advocates for just shooting Kelly Kline. I'd like to point out here, that "just kill everything" actually DOES make the job easier to do for people of less skill. You have to be MORE skilled in combat, knowledge, and experience, in order to deal with nuances. Think about it like a customer service job (because one of my jobs is customer survice) - if every time there is a complaint, you said "oh sorry, here's a 10% off coupon for your next order." your job is 100x easier than someone who says "oh, sorry, let me see if I can address the complications of your particular situation and come up with a customized solution just for you." The BMoL hand out death coupons and make all the problems go away.
Rewrite: I actually DO like the level of freaked-out Mick is when he hears what happened, but I would like to dial it up - make it clear that they've never dealt with Lucifer before. Make it clear that they've never dealt with rogue angels before... make it clear that the BMoL are out of their depth and the Winchesters aren't.
So, more flashbacks to kid-Mick - we find out the test is to make sure they'll execute orders without question. I think the same could be indicated with a monster child.
Then we get the call from Britain, where the headmistress person, tells Mick that his mission parameters have changed. And the Winchesters either obey, or they're killed.
Rewrite: You just need to change the language a little - have Mick be report about how he's trying to understand what code, if any, the Winchesters follow - have HQ tell him that if he can't prove that they follow THEIR code, and if they can't be brought to heel, then they should be eliminated.
Dagon and Kelly stuff can stay the same, FYI, just cut out the bits where Lucifer is talking to Dagon. In the rewrite, Dagon is doing this for her own purposes alone.
We get more of Mick's tragic backstory - and a great insight into the fact that he was most likely coerced into joining as a kid, but didn't question it because his alternative was homelessness, but now is beginning to feel trapped.
Crowley and Lucifer scenes... blah...sorry sorry, I'll stop complaining. In order to rewrite this scene, I have to figure out what it's purpose is... Lucifer is pretending to be broken, supposedly in order to avoid the cage. So...
Rewrite: Asmodeus (and/or) Dagon make a show of respecting Crowley's reign, after having previously threatened him. Crowley is suspicious...
Back to Ketch and Mary... Ketch IS actually acting way more domestic in his relationship with Mary than Mary is. And Ketch asks about her former retirement and how she seems drawn to danger - and I think this is another case of someone trying to interpret Mary the way they want to, rather than the way she is.
Remy and Mick scene - this scene can stay. We could even add an edge to it, with a simple rewrite of having the home office concerned about needing more hands, now that there's news of the nephilim - which further shows that they don't know how to deal with this level of stuff.
Eileen!!
Stuff about this scene I love - how both Sam and Dean modify their body language and speaking habits. They face Eileen head-on. When Sam's been speaking, but Dean wants to ask a question, he moves his hand from behind Sam's head to in front of himself, so that Eileen knows he wants her to listen to him.
I love the little flashback of Eileen killing the demon. "Hunter!" "Demon." Hahaha
Back with Crowley... let's see what the point of this scene is... Crowley makes a bit todo about having broken Lucifer, meanwhile, Lucifer uses it as an opportunity to undermine him by showing that he hasn't been broken at all and is fooling Crowley, therefore Crowley undermines his own authority by showing him off - which is stupid to have fallen for.
So, rewrite: Instead of Crowley being an idiot (because he's NOT), he's not in this scene. Instead, we get Asmodeus, or his messenger, addressing the court while Crowley is "out" and telling them that Crowley's reign is coming to an end, and any show of loyalty they made was just to keep him complacent and his defensive low so that he can be usurped by one (or both) of the Princes of Hell.
Now, bonus points rewrite: Crowley is actually overhearing this, and or, has a plant in the thrown room, and HEARS all this, and we get his reaction - is he angry? Is he tied? Does he double down his defenses? Does he want to retire anyway? We could be left with intriguing questions of character here as well as feel anticipation for how this coup may or may not go down.
Sam's funny accent is awesome.
Sam finding Eileen hilarious and awesome is cute.
And we get the showdown in by the bridges with the BMoL, Kelly, and Dagon.
Abortion conversations are always difficult. I was actually surprised they pulled off this storyline without any super problematic language.
And Eileen takes the shot, but Dagon fades out and she accidentally shoots Remy.
Friendly fire, man. Sucks.
So then we finally get the code conflicting directly with the Winchester's mercy. And Sam talks him down. It's actually the Free Will argument that they had back int he day with Castiel, though that was less obvious - there's more to life than blind obedience. And Mick lets them go.
Then Ketch and Mary have had sex. Mary gives him the "this was a one-night stand" speech. Ketch covers, but not well enough for us to actually believe him.
Ketch then commends her for making the choice of work, rather than family. Mary takes umbrage with the either/or argument. But, in so doing, DOES indicate that she's not 100x loyal to the BMoL.
Okay, Lucifer scene - this is just us learning that there's a delay in the coup to usurp Crowley.
Rewrite: So, do we need this scene? No, I don't think so... we COULD just cut it. OR... we could have Crowley do something that delays whatever Asmodeus has planned.
Sam comforts Eileen, and I love them.
Kelly is cuffed up by Dagon, and the truth comes out - the baby will live regardless of how well Kelly looks after herself during the pregnancy, but Kelly will surely die regardless at the end of the pregnancy.
And Ketch kills Mick.
We can see this as a foreshadow for someone who is changed by the Winchesters losing their life BECAUSE of that change (which we will see with Crowley at the end of the season.)
So, although I like Mick, I suppose we can keep it in. It IS a good death, in that it foreshadows another, and there's very little way that Mick can get out of this situation. ALSO, Mick NEEDS to lose command and not have any way of warning the Winchesters - because we need it to be clear that
Rewrite: "They will be investigated, and if they're found guilty, they will be executed..." would become "Your investigation should have been concluded, and the Winchesters found guilty" and then Mick could make his argument that Hunters are always found guilty and it's not right." And then she could say "We do need them for the time-being, however, they obviously have connections to the Nephilim.." or whatnot, which would explain why Ketch just doesn't go kill them right off the bat.
Really, in both the original and my rewrite, it would be this scene where we'd find out that MICK was the "rogue" agent while Toni was very much in keeping with the company line.
And yes, the BMoL can still hunt Eileen, I'm not changing that (yet).
The boys don't know where Cas is and are starting to get really worried.
But they DO have the Colt, for now. (RIP)
Dean: "Welcome back, sweetheart"
- I really do wish they could have kept it.
Then we get the extermination order from the BMoL, which can also still stand.
CUT SCENES
Scene 25
Sam and Dean researching in the Bunker, before Eileen arrives. Dean likes the movie ParentTrap.
Eileen calls. Sam picks up and says hi Eileen, and Dean yells from across the room "HEY EILEEN" and Sam looks at him super annoyed, because she can't hear him.
It's definitely a pretty pointless scene.
COMMENTARY
BuckLeming and Adam Fergus (Mick) and David Haydn-Jones (Ketch)
David of course doesn't have an accent IRL, so it's funny to hear him talk on the commentary.
Buckner thinks that the killing your friend thing is a great showcase of how ruthless they are. My argument of course is that killing a monster kid is ALSO ruthluss and makes WAY more sense.
Eugunie talking about how when the show started, Dean was the hardlined one and Sam was independent thinking and more nuanced in his views - but now seasons later, they're both independent thinkers. So it's them encountering a hardline thinker again.
Adam talks about how in the scene in the Bunker with Sam and Dean, how Jensen kept pouring the whiskey everywhere because he wasn't looking where he was pouring.
That leads them into a conversation about how welcoming the boys are and how it's the reason the show has lasted as long as it has, etc.
David and Buckner have similar voices so it's hard for me to figure out who is speaking unless they're saying something job specific. ONE of them talks about how the show has lasted because the creators behind it are also passionate about it and have remained so.
Jensen encouraged Adam to adlib in the scene in the kitchen.
David asks about how much was imagined from the beginning of the season - Eugunie says that it's discovered as it goes. They have a vague idea, but sometimes they want to detour mid season, or change things up, and it's decisions made along the way.
Buckner says that they knew the BMoL were going to be the "heavies" but they didn't have all the burocracy figured out.
Eugenie talks about how the actors make you want to write for them.
Buckner talks about how Mick and Ketch were good opposities to Sam and Dean's flannel wearing cowboys.
Eugenie talks about how the boys always act like it's fresh, and never act like they're board after 13 years.
Buckner talks about how Mick knows that the boys know that he's conflicted at times.
The Vodka line was adlibbed by Adam, because they had him drinking tomato juice, which he would never drink unless it was a Bloody Mary.
David talks about how he was reading for procedurals between episodes of Supernatural and they seemed so boring in comparison.
Eugunie had a lot of fun with the Crowley and Lucifer scenes, and apparently acted it out in their office before presenting it - and then acted it out when they presented it. (...gross? Also, just cements how much me and these writers differ in what we like.)
Buckner talks about how Pellegrino acts Lucifer as either wanting to kill everyone or sleep with everyone and no real in between.
David jokes that he should possess Ketch next, because they'd get along well.
Eugenie thinks that Ketch does have "pieces of a soul." David talks about how he was obviously conditioned way harder than anyone else.
They all make fun of Remy.
Adam and David loved the suits. They were all gorgeous.
They praise Shoshanah (So why'd you kill her, you asses? Ugh.)
Then they go back to praising Jensen and Jared for setting the tone, and that's probably part of the reason why the secondary characters are all so great too and the guest actors all are happy to work too.
Adam talks about doing his first scene with Jared and how Jared immediately starteed making fun of his accents - and it was just "banter from day one"
Oh, it was the scene in the throne room that Eugenie and Buckner acted out.
They talk about how if you really want something in the script you have to fight for it.
They praise Pellegrino.
They laugh about how the demons and minions are always just people in suits.
David talks about how the pregnancy nicely tees up S13. David really sounds like he's a genuine fan of the show.
They make fun of Jared's "british" accents.
David doesn't think that Jared and Jensen knew that he wasn't actually British, because he did a "weird actory thing" where he never broke accent - because he didn't want to lose it.
Adam tells a story about how there were train tracks between the trailors and sets, and a few times they got stuck behind really long trains trying to get to set and ended up late.
Eugenie talks about how Vancouver really helps the show. "There is a lurking doom" - hahah, okay, I do like that description of Vancouver.
They talk about the Shaving People Punting Things re-edit of this scene.
They talk about how brutal it was to shoot - because it was night, and cold, with a lot of different coverage, stunts, effects, etc.
Eugenie jokes that no one felt bad for Remy, because he was a twit.
They talk about Mary sleeping with Ketch, mostly the laugh at it. And are they both lying or is it just Ketch. And will the fans forgive Mary for "cheating" on John (I mean, it's not cheating if he's dead, guys. I don't think this is an issue.)
Buckner talks about how they didn't really know what would happen with Mary at the beginning of the season, but they didn't want to go the sainted-mom route... they wanted to make it clear that she was a hunter at heart. Buckner talks about how she was almost the genesis more than John was.
Buckner talks about the myth created after her feath. David agrees and likes how the audience pushes back with that emotionally and that just mirrors the conflict that's happening with the boys as well.
They talk about how great the lighting crew and the production is.
Adam agrees and describes how well oiled it is. Everyone knows what to do without it even really being asked of them - and how it feels like you get an extra day of filming because of it.
Then they talk about the sets and how gorgeous they are. David talks about being in the Bunker and how you don't even have to use your imagination, because it feels like the bunker not a set.
Buckner or David ship Sam and Eileen too... I can't tell who was speaking, I think it may have been Buckner.
Do commentary tracks have closed captioning?! Nope, only the show.. damn. So much for solving my David/Buckner problem. ACCESSIBILITY PEOPLE!
I was distracted there... uh....
They're talking about Mick, and how he's sort of like Oliver Twist.
Adam thinks Mick knows what's going to happen to him for criticizing Hess - even if he doesn't know that Ketch is going to shoot him right then and there.
BuckLeming originally had a storyline where Mick, Toni, and Ketch, were all together as children and had to survive some sort of survivor type test... and you got to explore where they came from and how they formed the way they formed.
Eugenie doesn't think that Ketch has ever been exposed to the moral complications of the world.
Adam talks about the boarding school systems in England and how it is more of a posh thing to do. And how Mick would feel indebted to them for taking him off the streets etc.
David thinks of Ketch as both posh and primal.
As usual, let me know your thoughts in comments!!
